OpenGeofiction
Hello Community!
I’ve been working on my capital Pyingshum for nearly as long as a year. I think it’s time to go over the project in a bit more detail, and get some overall feedback and comments.
1. History
The history on the wiki article is quite wordy and yet not very detailed regarding the development of the cityscape. So, here is a sketch of ~when each area was (for the most part) developed.
Of course the city already had some low density suburbs outside the motorway circle before the 1950’s, but the parts inside of it were mostly developed by then (apart from the blue social housing zones). Also I think I drew the “1950’s” line to close to the centre, just think about it as if the inner city had been more or less developed until the 50’s, then the circular motorway was built and the outer suburbs were forming ;)
2. Suburbs
Of course a city so big often leads to growth in close towns nearby, and most of them now are just another suburb in the big city. Inside of the inner city there are 5 former separate town centres, that now became just another local shopping/entertainment centre. These places were growing maybe as early as the medieval ages, and fused with Pyingshum before the dawn of the 20th century.
Further out there are another 5 local centres; I imagine that they might have existed parallel to the large city and might even have developed independently throughout the times of industrialisation. With the rise of the automobile they then were knit even tighter together with their big neighbour, until at some point the suburbs just merged. Now they are mostly densely built up side-cores, that also serve as little transportation and local supply hubs.
3. Residential
Pyingshum was inspired by real-world Paris from the very beginning, and I was/am fascinated by the idea of having the city’s elite living closely together in an architecturally rich urban core. Income in general is mostly distributed according to building substance in the city. Of course there will be low density neighbourhoods for all income classes further out, but they don’t concern me yet.
4. Businesses
This mostly concerns shopping and entertainment. I think the sketch should be self-explanatory, of course not even the inner city is completely filled out yet.
5. Traffic
I tried to create a general overview over transportation in the city, but I think it’s best to just check Pyingshum’s Metro’s article on the wiki, or, well, look at the map… I’m having a hard time estimating transportation demand, but I guess that’s just something that can’t be helped. However, here we have my attempt at summarising the city’s most important traffic arteries:
I welcome any ideas, thoughts, comments or criticism! I’d love to hear what you think so far about the city, and what places you’d like to visit there ;) I haven’t been focusing on single points of interest for this diary entry, as I rather want to give you a general overview over this project. Thank you very much for your patience, and have a good day,
~leo
Discussion
Comment from isleño on 30 January 2016 at 18:49
I think it’s a great start. It’s really nice to see in-depth thinking about historical development, a language that’s so distinctive and unique, and a city with so many interesting areas to explore. This place is going to be amazing by the time it reaches its full size… :-)
Comment from Luciano on 30 January 2016 at 20:45
I like seeing so much thoughtful and careful work about evolultion of the city space. When I finally decide to tackle my “re-boot” of Villa Constitución, I am inspired by your sketches as to some approaches to make that successful.
If I have any criticism, it is that there is still something a bit “schematic” about the city - real cities almost never evolve into almost perfect circles (Milan or Indianapolis being the exceptions that prove the rule - both on extremely flat, riverine plains). Cities generally have these assymmetrical protrusions of urban space into the surrounding countryside - up and down the Seine, in Paris, for example, or around areas of hills, mountains or wetland, or along major routes like highways and rail trunk lines. There is also the “leapfrog” phenomenon, which you’re starting to capture with your idea of preexisting towns absorbed into the metropolis. Separate towns at each station or highway exit, initially linked to the metropolis, first by rail and later by highway, which eventually merge together. This is extremely difficult to pull off realistically in geofiction, I’ve decided, without a genuinely historical/evolutionary approach.
Comment from Leowezy on 30 January 2016 at 21:30
Thank you both :) I think I will try to “squeeze” the outer fringes of the suburbs a bit; have a little bulge around the local centre in the west, and have stretches of settlement going to the north-east and south-west along the river. Maybe I will move the forests and even the airport in the north all 5km to the south, and the southern forests to the north, while creating a bit more “open” space along the river. I will also move the main southwards railway line to the west for a bit and have it follow the river… but this will all take time.
Anyways, I’ve decided quite a time ago that I will map the suburbs of the city only up to the level of tertiary roads, with zoning indicating the extend of urban sprawl and major commercial/retail areas. That should be enough detail, as the suburbs will be “boring” residential for the most part, and I don’t want to take the bait and just copy and paste some generic suburbian road network over and over again…
Comment from Sarepava on 30 January 2016 at 21:35
Wow, this is fantasticly detailed and very believable. The city feels like a nineteenth-century center with contemporary Japanese or Korean suburbs which you’ve captured the essence of well. Love the bus station to the north and the buildings in the downtown area.
In my experience, the more you think about a country’s history and culture, the more you ‘discover’ and the deeper and more detailed it goes - it’s like a kind of archaeology.
Also, I forget to build the Karolian embassy in Pyingshum yet…will get to it soon.
Comment from Leowezy on 30 January 2016 at 21:55
Thanks Sarepava :) If you want to, I’m more than happy to place the embassy for you and add it to the list.
Just one question, what do you mean by “contemporary Japanese or Korean suburbs”? Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure maps always induce different pictures about reality with different people, but I actually envisioned the city centre as you said as kind of a 19th century jewel, but the rest of the inner city filled out with European style medium density like this (note the mix of older and “newer” [=uglier in this case] apartment buildings), and the suburbs a mix of all different types of low density residential. The japanese suburbs I’ve seen online (and I’m happy to say that I will finally be able to spend 3 weeks in Japan in about half a year :D) seem much, much denser even in the outer zones of the city.
Again, if that was just the picture you had in mind, perhaps also because of how Kojolese place names sound that’s fine, but if you think there’s anything particular about the road layout leading to this image I would be happy to know more about it :)
Comment from Luciano on 30 January 2016 at 22:15
The Korean “suburb” that is my home is much higher density than anything I have ever seen in even the densest parts of North American cities that I’m familiar with (except perhaps Manhattan or Del. Cuauhtemoc in Mexico City). I’m not as familiar with European cities. As far as the street layouts, my impression of Pyingshum is definitely more “Europe” rather than Korea or Japan - as Leowezy suggests, I think it is the naming aspect that hints at Japan or Korea. I rather like the mix - speaking as someone who is only half-successfully attempting a hybrid of Latin American and Asian.
Comment from Thunderbird on 31 January 2016 at 04:50
Wow, this looks amazing so far! The way you drew the inner city looks like it took a long time, those old European city centers are way harder to draw than newer american “grid city” designs (like what i’m doing.) By contrast, American suburbs are likely harder to draw than some other suburbs because American suburbs have winding streets and in places like South America the suburbs are grids.
Like Luciano, I agree while the names may seem Japanese or Korean, the streets and planning definitely have a European look to them.
A very detailed area like Kyaoling-Pang must have taken a long time to draw, but it looks great!
Leowezy, I get worried when you say people “cut-and-paste” suburbs because I have been working on some residential streets that all have a similar pattern, they are very time consuming and I would never want anyone to think I cut and pasted them! Could you give me an example of a place where someone did? I didn’t even think you could.
Comment from Luciano on 31 January 2016 at 05:30
So far, I have never “cut and pasted” street patterns, but I use the technique a lot to create my detailed landuse/landcover polygons - it’s the only way I can cover so much territory with so much detail. I paste down a bunch of polygons, then I go in and randomly vary the landcovers associated with them a little bit. JOSM supports cut and paste quite well. I also used cut and paste when I was placing row houses in Gobras City (Ward 14). I think it has its uses. If I ever get to the point of creating those “winding street” US style suburbs, I think cut and paste could work well - as long as you go in afterward and customize a little bit.
Comment from Leowezy on 31 January 2016 at 11:38
If you have a look at my newest city, Rō, you’ll see some suburbs that I’ve created so far. One portion in the east-southern part was actually copy-pasted from the other side of the city, but to make it fit with existing roads you basically have to go over every single street and tweak a bit. As Luciano said, I think when you have patterns that are genuinely repetitive even in the real world, like row houses, copy pasting makes sense. I’ve also copy pasted patterns of landuses along the river in the surroundings of Pyingshum, although I’m not very happy with how it looks like currently. I really with there was a tag for “general agricultural use” xD But in general it really doesn’t help with making realistic cities. If you have very large cities, and you think the suburban structures are simple enough to just copy-paste, I think one might as well just don’t map to the street level at all and only map tertiary roads and upwards and land usage, as I plan to do with Pyingshum.
Comment from Luciano on 31 January 2016 at 13:29
I like those suburbs in Rō. It definitely works well. Impressive!